Comments on: Theme Frameworks – They’re Not That Simple

By: Moi

Moi — Mon, 20 Dec 2010 05:44:10 +0000

I agree with Sharon that the sales pitches for Headway and Thesis are misleading.

It is NOT that easy for newbies to web design to create their own layouts based on either of these frameworks. Customizing a theme requires lots of reading, an understanding of WordPress and how the hooks, etc. work. It helps to have experience with CSS and PHP as well.

I'm a web designer with years of experience and even I have a learning curve with how WordPress and how the frameworks with WordPress. But it's easier for me than someone with no experience with CSS or PHP.

So, it's misleading to advertise that newbies can create their own designs with little to no code.

I tried Headway first and requested a refund because the forum tanked. It started off as a normal forum where members could freely exchange ideas and then turned into something restrictive and annoying. That and some other issues with Headway convinced me to try Thesis. I'm currently experimenting with that one and like it so far. I love the forum and resources.

As a web designer, I like digging into code to customize pages. Otherwise, I wouldn't feel like I'm really doing my job.

By: Themepremium

Themepremium — Sun, 14 Feb 2010 16:40:27 +0000

Initially I used to think thesis is a simpe theme but later On I realize its not a theme but a framework and many themes can be derived using this theme. Sigh!! I'm such a noob !

By: Vivek @ InfoEduTech

Vivek @ InfoEduTech — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 14:21:28 +0000

i have recently got thesis theme and studying the theme framework. its framework it lot more different than woo theme framework.

Having a sound knowledge of CSS and PHP will give you an extra edge in framework design.

I am going to start a new blog which will provide complete information on web designing languages and photoshop skills.

need the best wishes from this blogosphere so that i can contribute my part in this blogosphere

By: Justin Tadlock

Justin Tadlock — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 11:58:50 +0000

The fact that you just quoted that material lets me know that you don't understand what a framework is. I can't tell you whether Thesis and Headway are true frameworks. I haven't looked at the code behind them. But, if you want to look at a real framework, take a look at Carrington.

By: John Zemler

John Zemler — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 10:10:25 +0000

Thank you for writing this post. From a users perspective it is quite helpful that one does not have to play with code as much. I am new to Thesis and it has its learning curve, but the time spent learning there will always be useful.

I have also found Thesis support forums useful, but a complete in-house tutorial would be helpful. This is true for all the theme designers and not just Thesis.

For the advanced teacho-mage web devs, if they desire to edit more than two files, then more power to them. For the unskilled like myself, the fewer places I have to interact with code the better.

Recently Alex Denning came out with his WPShift drag and drop theme. I saw it annpounced on his WPShout website. I have not yet tried it.

Thank You and Semper Pax, Dr. Z

By: Sharon Hurley Hall

Sharon Hurley Hall — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 07:05:36 +0000

Understanding basic PHP and CSS definitely help, Brian. Thanks for the recommendation of Genesis. I haven't tried it yet, but I will.

By: Sharon Hurley Hall

Sharon Hurley Hall — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 07:04:18 +0000

There's a learning curve, Tom and as Andy says above, it can really help you with learning CSS (and PHP).

By: Sharon Hurley Hall

Sharon Hurley Hall — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 07:02:58 +0000

I think the rationale for designers/developers and non-techies is different, Anthony. Both Thesis and Headway mention the advantages to non-techies of not having to mess with code.

By: Sharon Hurley Hall

Sharon Hurley Hall — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 07:01:43 +0000

Thanks for the recommendation, Melissa. I haven't tried Genesis, but have used Brian Gardner's themes before and found them to be excellent.

By: Sharon Hurley Hall

Sharon Hurley Hall — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 07:00:19 +0000

That may be true for developers, Justin, and I know it's also what you say on your Hybrid Themes site, but both Headway and Thesis tout designing without messing with code as main features. From the Headway site: "For non-technical folks, Headway’s “Easy Hooks” let you insert custom content at will wherever you like on any page without messing with PHP or CSS. " and from the DIYThemes site: "The Thesis philosophy is simple—you can change your design all you want, but you should never change the core code that powers your website."

By: Jewelry Secrets

Jewelry Secrets — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 01:31:42 +0000

I've really been thinking about incorporating a blog into my site. I'm leaning towards Thesis since I have a knack for code and figuring out how it works. I like to tinker. Plus, I've seen some great sites built with Thesis that pretty much sold me. Great comparisons. How about some examples?

By: Justin Tadlock

Justin Tadlock — Fri, 12 Feb 2010 00:28:28 +0000

Theme frameworks are generally created so you don’t have to mess around too much with the basic code.

This is the exact opposite of what a theme framework is. Theme frameworks are about allowing developers to more easily and quickly create sites by using a set of conventions laid out by the framework.

The point is to be touching code.

The misinformation spreading throughout the WordPress community about what theme frameworks are is just getting out of hand at this point.

By: Anthony Feint

Anthony Feint — Thu, 11 Feb 2010 21:46:43 +0000

Frameworks were created so you could mess around with the code! Thats the whole point.

If you want an awesome looking blog, that is unique you need to know some coding skills. Otherwise don't buy a framework theme

By: Melissa Donovan

Melissa Donovan — Thu, 11 Feb 2010 20:22:52 +0000

Thanks Sharon! I'm the market for theme frameworks to add to my repertoire, and the information you've shared here has been extremely helpful. I'm bummed to hear that you found Headway's drag-and-drop a little buggy.

Also, I agree with Brian's recommendation of StudioPress. I've been using Brian Gardner's themes since the early Revolution and have found the code to be clean and incredibly easy to work with. I'm a big fan of StudioPress.

By: Tom | Build That Lis

Tom | Build That Lis — Thu, 11 Feb 2010 16:38:09 +0000

Thesis definitely requires an education stage, but once you understand how it all works – it really is quite easy to edit.